12 replies to this topic

[Rob]

What do you guys do out there? I could do either ...

So are there any legal restrictions on using OSCommerce..
Benefits to using it?
Benefits to writing your own....

I'd love to see your opinions on this and what you actually do.

Many thanks!

Rob

[essexell]

In something I read somewhere (could have been this forum!!) someone compared e-commerce packages to word processing software. They posed the question: What would you do if someone came to you for a word processer? Answer: get MS word, or Star office. What you wouldn't do is write the software from scratch. The point they were making was that the development of ecommerce scripts has come so far, that you would need to spend a ridiculous amount of time (money!) on development to create something of the same specification.

I now use an e-commerce package for my clients (though not OS Commerce) - one that I pay for - and it means that I can concentrate on making the site look good, and function well, without having to worry about security issues and whether my programming is up to it or not. The software that I use has been developed, improved and refined over the last six or so years - how could I hope to come close?

Unless the client needs a really bespoke, or a really simple package - I think I'd always go for the ready built option.

Elliot

[Rob]

Many thanks Elliot,

From that i'm guessing you would go the OS-Commerce route? I was wondering if there were any implications with this?

Rob

[essexell]

Of the two choiuces you've given, I would go with OS Commerce. But personally I'd prefer to pay a few hundred quid and get a fully developed product that gets regular updates - and most importantly - telephone support etc.

I suppose it depends on how critical the site will be to it's owners.

What sort of implications do you mean?

Elliot

[Randy]

I would go with the approach Elliot outlined, for the same reasons. The amount of time it would take to develop a shopping cart system from the ground up would be a ridiculous investment unless you were planning on selling it to others once you got it done. I don't see any other way you could ever recoup that cost.

As far as OSC is concerned, it is Open Source. So if you need to make any changes or tweaks for which someone hasn't already built a module, you could certainly do that. There are no real restrictions to it that I am aware of.

That's one of the main things I look at when I choose a shopping cart for any project. Does the software do what I need it to do, and if not can I tweak the code so that it will. My main concern is whether the cart is search engine friendly out of the box, for obvious reasons.

The support aspect mentioned above is certainly a factor to take into account. A large one in fact. OSC doesn't have that in the normal sense of Support, they do however maintain a large following and many of those folks are quite happy to help if you run into any issues.

[arlen]

I opted for a service rather than a software package based on the recommendation of a friend who has used them for years (Americart). I don't know how it compares to osCommerce, or if it's a similar package. I do know there are at least 2 or 3 similar services available. In the long run, it's probably not as cost effective or as flexible, but for startup it's more affordable. The benefits as I see them are

- I don't need SSL on my server, it all happens on their server using their verisign certificate. Also means I don't need a unique ip address.
- I don't need to learn cgi right now, as their code is very simple and html based. The learning curve is steep enough, and I've got enough to manage as it is.
- I can host my site anywhere I wish - most hosts only support one software package from what I've seen, and changing hosts "could" require a complete redo of the shopping cart functions. Because it's html based, and they host the cgi, etc. I have no hosting restrictions.
- So far, excellent e-mail support. There are things I would have liked to have done that aren't feasible with their setup, but they have worked with me to get things running in a manner I'm satisfied with.

I don't have much live experience yet, but have processed a few orders and everything went quite smoothly. I may change my approach at some point in the future, but for now I'm quite satisfied.

Just my thoughts

[Rob]

I would go with the approach Elliot outlined, for the same reasons. The amount of time it would take to develop a shopping cart system from the ground up would be a ridiculous investment unless you were planning on selling it to others once you got it done. I don't see any other way you could ever recoup that cost.

As far as OSC is concerned, it is Open Source. So if you need to make any changes or tweaks for which someone hasn't already built a module, you could certainly do that. There are no real restrictions to it that I am aware of.

That's one of the main things I look at when I choose a shopping cart for any project. Does the software do what I need it to do, and if not can I tweak the code so that it will. My main concern is whether the cart is search engine friendly out of the box, for obvious reasons.

The support aspect mentioned above is certainly a factor to take into account. A large one in fact. OSC doesn't have that in the normal sense of Support, they do however maintain a large following and many of those folks are quite happy to help if you run into any issues.

Thanks for the comments and suggestions all ..

Randy - do you purchase a seperate app per client and bill it to them?

From some of the other comments it looked like some cart packages are out the box and re-usable, but maybe they're tied to a a serial and therefore per/cart billing?

Thanks,

Rob

[Randy]

Most of the commercial carts are per client/per domain Rob. So in that case, yes it's a cost of doing business that is passed on to the client.

I'm in a little bit different place since I run the servers. Back in the day when I used to actually SEO for others I'd simply buy a Server License for the cart and still charge for it. My cash outlay up front, and a (very) small profit after that.

I never fulfilled any of those server licenses because I never found anything that worked across the board for every site.

That's one of the reasons OSC isn't a bad choice at all. At least you're not paying out of pocket for it. But you will need to build some "configuration" time into the mix if you're doing it for a client.

[Rob]

Thanks Randy.

Config time is fair enough ... If I was a client I would rather pay that than for an app .. (as long as i don't take too long ) .. the cost of an e-comm site is always more and to be expected though, so it works out just right.

One of my main fears about OSCommerce is, being open source, it could be vulnerable ... hence my question here .... but it looks like no one is really using OSCommerce ... hmm :s

[DaveBeck]

Rob, I think you'll find osCommerce is a fantastic shopping cart solution.

There is a bit of a learning curve that you need to take to make it do exactly what your situation requires, however once you get under the bonnet you will see that possibilities are endless.

These days I tend to refer to osCommerce as more of an eCommerce engine than a shopping cart!

As for support, the osCommerce team do not actively support the software. There is however a very active and friendly community of store owners and developers ready to answer your questions. The community forum is very similar to this one in attitude and there is a multitude of contributions available to help you customize your store.

I hope that helps

Dave

[delridge]

For anyone who falls into the category of "total newbie but still a died-in-the-wool DIY'er" (like me), another option is to pick one of the low-cost (one or two hundred bucks) carts out there.

I went with clickcartpro. That small up-front cost got me some newbie-friendly initial instruction, a little more than I could find with oscommerce and just enough to pull away from a dead stop (the day before, I didn't even know what a shopping cart was -- had to look it up on google).

Once you get underway, they also have a pretty good, and quite active, forum for further advice/help/direction.

It's not "open source" per se, but you do have full access to the underlying code (Perl), so you can make whatever mods you want (they just don't want you repackaging it and reselling it as your own). Their forum is filled with people giving examples of mods they've done, large and small.

Matt

[Randy]

Welcome Matt !

[projectphp]

In something I read somewhere (could have been this forum!!) someone compared e-commerce packages to word processing software. They posed the question: What would you do if someone came to you for a word processer? Answer: get MS word, or Star office.

Hmm. On the surface this sounds reasonable, but I have one huge issue with it: a word processor lacking a feature isn't a business killer. An ecommerce app that lacks a feature could cost thousands, if not millions, of dollars.

Very few software packages are written by marketing people. As such, they are written to solve programming problems, not necessarily to maximise marketing potential. This may sound like I am splitting hairs, but the difference is massive.

Programmers love tech and problem solving (I did an IT degree, so I speak from experience). As an example: how does one guarantee 100% accuracy for stats? Answer: Use sessions. Is that a good marketing decision? Hell no! The perspective here dictated the response. I have a programmatic problem to solve leads to sessions. I have a need for marketing metrics that improve sales leads to a compromise on teh side of greater sales.

What exists is a gulf between the goals of the developers (programming constraints, validating code and other tech concerns) and sales and marketing goals (moving product, generating leads and ensuring long term customer loyalty). The two are not mutually exclusive, but neither are they mutually inclusive.

Any out of the box solution will most probably need tweaking to make it exactly what one requires. As such, the single most important factor of all is access to change code. If you don't get that, its a deal breaker for mine.

beyond that, you say po-tay-to and i say po-tart-oe. Most choices are pretty similiar, and boil down to political and programming preference.