223 replies to this topic

[WyattEA]

Welcome WyattEA !

Jill was replying to piskie, who she quoted. You see, piskie has made something of a sport of disagreeing with Jill, probably just to be contrary. So the statement Jill quoted was a bit funny.

As far as splitting Link Pop, the park by itself is not going to take any link popularity away from the current site. Its links point to it. Where we talk about splitting link pop it's because some links point to one domain name and some point to another. So if they were all pointed to a single location you might have more concentration to that single location, but otherwise one doesn't actually take away link pop from the other.

Eventually the engines will normailly merge the two domains together all on their own, thus giving you a bit of a boost as link popularity is merged. But if you have a .com that's already ranking it shouldn't have any negative effect on that front by parking a .ca on top of it to start getting geo targeted traffic.

ahhhh said the blind man

I lost my 'status' as canadian which dropped my traffic considerably so I'm doing the old 'park the .ca' to establish canadian-ness. Does it matter what I get to point to the .ca to get it spidered? I Have a PR4 site that is a CDN directory of sites (most sites linking to it are canadian) but that domain is also classified as non-canadian for the same reason my current site is (which in both cases was not-intential but happened because I used a privatedns.org company to hide my domain ownership (thinking i would cut down on spam, not hurt my rankings by not getting any traffic from canadians).

Is the point of linking sites to the .ca just to get google to spider it or do i have to make sure the sites linking to it are also canadian?

James...

[piskie]

I may be wrong and must stress that this is only an opinion:

I understand that PR is like currency and as such can only be spent once. Further if this currency is shared between a number of pages linked out to from a page with PRX, each receiving page gets an equal share of PRX. Thereby if a page links out to 4 pages, each of those 4 pages receives a quarter of PRX. The way I see it, each outgoing link from a page has a single target landing page so there should be no effect on this "Share" of PR by parking because that only produces additional duplicates on different URL's that are not receivers of the current incoming Links in question.

Now I understand that parking will produce a second URL for each page. If I have got that wrong, just ignore the following.

As this now flirts with duplication issues that will be a further consideration needing clarification from something stronger than an opinion. Duplication (we are led to believe) is not a penalty, but a filter. This results in only one page of 2 (or more) identical pages being returned in the SERPs. Now Is Google (and Co.) going to operate a selective/switchable filter that will return the appropriate page from these Dupes according to the Geographic Location of the Search Request. I don't know, but would love to find out if someone out there has established this.

[Randy]

James:

Getting any links will help the .ca domain, but if it were me I would concentrate on trying to find sites that are Canadian to further strengthen the idea that it is indeed a Canadian site for the search engines. Basically, I would specifically target other .ca sites for link building, though I certainly wouldn't turn down links that aren't from Canadian sites.

Make sense?

Piskie:

If I'm reading you correctly, you're right. There are a couple of factors at play.

1. Duplication doesn't automatically cause any type of penalty.
2. The engines (especially Google at this point in time) will simply choose which URL it considers to be the Most Correct and Most Important given the specifics of any search. These specifics aren't just the keyword phrase being used by the searcher, but other factors like the type of search the user is conducing (Worldwide or Canadian Only) and also the users location or any personal prefences they may have set.

Given a case like is outlined, the .com is already being considered to be pretty UNimportant for Canadian-only searches because of the Geo nature of the specific searches. So for all intents and purposes at duplicate .ca site is not really going to be competing with itself, or with its .com self. The .ca should in theory always have an advantage over the .com for these very specific types of Geo searches.

So in this case there isn't really a duplication issue that should concern anyone.

[WyattEA]

All I want is for google to identify my IP as being a canadian site. Worst case, I'll host it with a canadian hosting co but there are SOOOO FEW good ones, I just can't believe it. I saw one that was offering 5 MEGABYTES of storage space as their PREMIUM service ($50 or $99 a month - can't remember).

I should mention my .com site is 6 years old, has 1000+ unique backlinks and is ranked well for everything it targets. We were already #1 - #2 for our main keywords on google.ca or when you searched for 'pages from canada only' before this problem when we were identified as a canadian site, so I'm not trying to get seen as canadian and then HOPE we can move up in the rankings, I'm trying to get back what we once were when seen as canadian. I think I'm talking in circles now - dizzy, need to lie down

Here's a question, once Google does re-identify me as a canadian site, would I have to keep the .ca park? I would think google wouldn't take away that status unless they checked my domain ownership again and i've fixed that to show my full canadian info.

James...

[TerribleTerry]

Stop !

Hosting your site on a server in a different country will not help you. At an SEO forum both Google and Yahoo were asked the very question you are asking. Both Yahoo and Google use a couple of indicators. One is an address in the site pages and a second is inbound links. Of the two inbound links is the number one deciding factor.

Parking a .ca domain name I am told helps but inbound links are the number one factor.

If you think about it, it makes sense too!

Terry

[WyattEA]

I am thinking about it and inbound links is the WORST factor because the USER has total control over that. Whether they just target CDN sites and eventually get some or PAY for them, their most important factor should not be so controllable. The word canada is probably in the top 5 for most used words on my site, and my full mailing address is online too, but I guess those don't matter. Google listed me as CDN and stopped when my domain ownership was changed to a privatedns service. I don't care what google or anyone else says, this wasn't a coincidence. I was CDN for 5 years until that change.

Wouldn't getting an IP located in CDN help the fastest, since google has to re-index the IP (so it's associated with the domain) and when it does that it might lookup the geolocation?

So how do i get inbound links from CANADIANS since I don't know what google considers CDN or not? am I suppose to see if they rank for anything when 'pages from canada' is checked? The quality of canadian hosting companies is a joke. The only good ones (good service/good price) are just US reseller. This is so annoying.

James...

Stop !

Hosting your site on a server in a different country will not help you. At an SEO forum both Google and Yahoo were asked the very question you are asking. Both Yahoo and Google use a couple of indicators. One is an address in the site pages and a second is inbound links. Of the two inbound links is the number one deciding factor.

Parking a .ca domain name I am told helps but inbound links are the number one factor.

If you think about it, it makes sense too!

Terry

I have 6 years of inbound links - I'm suppose to try to 'tip the scales' in favour of canadian inbound links? I seriously doubt there are enough canadian directories (that are hosted in Canada) to compete with that.

James...

Stop !

Hosting your site on a server in a different country will not help you. At an SEO forum both Google and Yahoo were asked the very question you are asking. Both Yahoo and Google use a couple of indicators. One is an address in the site pages and a second is inbound links. Of the two inbound links is the number one deciding factor.

Parking a .ca domain name I am told helps but inbound links are the number one factor.

If you think about it, it makes sense too!

Terry

[WyattEA]

Ok, I keep thinking of new comments/questions (sorry!)

You say 'inbound links' - I assumed you meant 'canadian inbound links' or ccLinks as Ian calls them. Or did you mean any links? In either case, are the new inbound links supposed to be for the .ca you have parked or the .com you're trying to get I.D.'d as CDN?

Thanks,

James...

Stop !

Hosting your site on a server in a different country will not help you. At an SEO forum both Google and Yahoo were asked the very question you are asking. Both Yahoo and Google use a couple of indicators. One is an address in the site pages and a second is inbound links. Of the two inbound links is the number one deciding factor.

Parking a .ca domain name I am told helps but inbound links are the number one factor.

If you think about it, it makes sense too!

Terry

[siringo]

Just started reading this post as I am affected by geo-location and need to raise my knowledge on the problem.

As this post was started just over 3 years ago, is the information within the post still accurate? I just don't want to waste my time if half of the 11 pages are out of date and misleading.


Thanks,
Matt.

[projectphp]

I feel the same way about maths! Is 1+1 still equal to 2?

[siringo]

I feel the same way about maths! Is 1+1 still equal to 2?

Thanks for the reply. I'm guessing you mean that the info in the post is all still accurate.

[projectphp]

I would never assume any forum thread is "accurate", certainly not in its entirety!!!

But if you read the whole thing, I bet you have a good enough answer to get started.

As with anything, the proof is in teh pudding, and I would first start by defining what success is, and seeing if the advice given works.

[mcanerin]

Hosting your site on a server in a different country will not help you. At an SEO forum both Google and Yahoo were asked the very question you are asking. Both Yahoo and Google use a couple of indicators. One is an address in the site pages and a second is inbound links. Of the two inbound links is the number one deciding factor.

This is untrue. About a year ago, MSN and Yahoo used inbound links, but Google never has. Google has always used IP address.

None of the search engines use addresses in the site pages itself, and they never have. I'm not certain where you get this information from but I got mine directly from the search engine representatives, and it's backed up by the sites that I run and the testing that I've personally done.

The order of preference currently is:

1. A ccTLD (for all 3 search engines)
2. IP address (for all 3 search engines)
3. Inbound links (for MSN and Yahoo).

If step one sets a country, they stop looking. If step one is a a gTLD, then they check IP, if that is inconclusive, then, and only then, do they check inbound links. This is accurate as of at least June of this year (2007)

Ian

[piskie]

Ian
If you are around, please you could briefly check and comment on my intentions below to launch a brand new site on probably 2 Domain Names with Identicle Content. Current intention is:

domain.com USA targeted - Hosting on USA Located Server.
domain.co.uk UK targeted - hosted on a UK located server.

Good positioning on Google, MSN and Yahoo required for both UK and USA originating searches
I am assuming that the Visitors Location when Searching Google etc will take care of the Duplication Filter.
Is this a workable strategy and are there any pitfalls. I am aware of .co.uk not necessarily requiring a UK located Server, but in this case I am separrating for good measure.

[mcanerin]

I would never recommend the creation of identical content. It's always better to have new, localized content for every site. Having said that, your plan is likely to work, as long as you also do the following:

1. Localize the content. Make sure that UK spellings are used instead of US ones, for example.

2. Remember that outside the US, the country is an important keyword. An American is very unlikely to search for "law firm US", for example, but someone in the UK is likely to type in "law firm UK" and related geoterms, for example. At the very least, most/all of your titles in the UK site should mention "UK" if your keywords lend themselves to it. So this does change the content, at least somewhat. Pet Peeve: the "Contact Us" page should ALWAYS be completely localized. Don't ask an Englishman for his Zip Code - it makes you look really bad. This is more of a usability issue than search, though. This is a good resource for international mailing information: http://www.bitboost....l#Great-Britain

3. DON'T try to hide the relationship between the sites. I find this is one of the worst things potential clients do. It makes you look like a spammer trying to show up in the same SERP more than once rather than an international company with similar products in more than one country. There is a difference. Google seems to treat international duplication almost as a canonical issue, rather than a spam issue. It tries to choose the one best site for the visitor, rather than lowering the trust given to all the sites involved.

Ian

[piskie]

Thanks Ian.

That was very close to what I wanted to hear.
This is a Yacht Charter in the BVI, so it does not exist in either target country. The geographic factor is just targeting 2 sales areas with SERPs being a major factor as the clients budget will not run to PPC.

In view of Your advice not to try and hide the relationship, should I host both sites on the USA located Server which would not harm the .co.uk aspect. I intended to be 100% duplication so as not appearing to be "Slightly" different along the lines of Your thinking of not trying to hide the relationship. My main reliance is on the geographic bias in the SERPs and Duplication being a Filter and not a penalty.