17 replies to this topic

[MIDA]

I am going to create a new e-commerce site selling gourmet gift baskets. As you can imagine the keyword competition will be fierce.

My goal with this is not just to rank well for "gourmet gift baskets" but I want each product detail page to do well for that specific product such as "Blueberry Gift Basket" etc...

I decided to purchase X-Cart because they have an add-on that will spit out a static version of the database site. They will also allow title and meta tag customization ability. Of course, for the user, the ease of putting the item in a cart, especially one that can be customized to provide an easy way to send baskets to different addresses is key.

My fear, all of the sudden, is will this "static" site just sit out there in isolation while I point all my links to the dynamic site? If Google actually does index the dynamic pages, will I be penalized for double content? I can ask the vendor (in Russia!) but I'm not sure they will know how SEs will react.

Does anyone have experience trying to spit out a static site or is the best method to implement a mod_rewrite. What about both?

Getting cold feet.....

THANKS!!!
MIDA

[Randy]

I'm not very familiar with X-cart anymore Mida, but do the static pages it generates have links going to the dynamic pages or do they have links leading to the other static pages? I would think it would be the latter, but it's been too long since I tinkered with x-cart.

If the static pages do link to the other static pages though, I would suggest simply Disallowing spider access to the dynamic pages. That should be nice and clean and completely remove the duplicate content issue.

[MIDA]

Hmmm, that seems like a good idea, thanks!

I've seen your advice in other topics, seems like you are very well versed in dynamic site issues, if you were developing a similar site - what cart would you use?

Thanks!
Shelley

[djonline]

MIVA can do everything you are desiring and more. I've never used or know much about x-cart, so I couldn't compare, but you may want to look at MIVA as well.

MIVA has an add on module available to create directory style links instead of the default dynamically created links (www.copernicusllc.com/page/CDC/PROD/MKT/CBS-OUISFL). I personally use this module and within 2 weeks of implementing the directory style links, all my product pages were spidered and indexed by Google.

Additionally, there are many other modules to aid SEO, such as "meta tag generator", "search friendly store map", and "stat kat" or "Search Engine Killer" (which are both modules that create static pages of all the dynamic pages, the only difference is Stat Kat has the option to have an "add to basket button" on the static pages).

You can also use OUI tokens in your meta tag area which pull the text from the product page and/or category page to give unique keywords and description for each product and category page.

And with OUI you have the ability to change your title tags on each and every page within MIVA.

I have found MIVA to be a very SE friendly e-commerce program.

If you do decide to go with MIVA, just make sure that you choose a MIVA knowledgable host and ask the host if they support 3rd party modules (which you will need if you want to be SE friendly). Not all MIVA hosts support and/or allow 3rd party modules but do not tell you this upfront.

Julie

[MIDA]

Wow Julie, that's good to know about MIVA because so many clients have purchased hosting because of MIVA.

I have to stick with X-Cart for at least one project. I'm trying to wrap my head around how the static site will work. I'm wondering if my logic is off so I'm going to post my question to X-Cart here:

I do have more questions about the HTML add-on that produces a static cart. I would like my home page to be completely static. As you may know optimizing a site for a highly competitive term like "gift bakets" requires that you leave no stone unturned (I hope that translates!) So, I have my static home page linking into the dynamic cart or should it be linked to the HTML static site? I need the text links on the home page to match the titles of the destination page. Example: on Home Page: <link>Gourmet Coffee Gift Baskets</link> points to the page that has "Gourmet Coffee Gift Baskets" in the Title tag, meta descriptions, and H1 tag on the page, etc... All of this tells the search engines that "this page is really about gourmet coffee gift baskets" and ranks it higher. Sooooo, long story to my question - how do I accomplish this? Will the static HTML generated site have consistent URLs?

Am I on the right track?

It seems like we are turning a big corner here with carts and SEO. I've searched high and low for a totally SEOable cart and other than one that charges about $150 a month for hosting, I haven't found it. Maybe X-Cart and MIVA are finally "getting it"??

Thank you so much, I've already learned quite a bit and am almost ready to build out the site!

[djonline]

Wow Julie, that's good to know about MIVA because so many clients have purchased hosting because of MIVA.

Hi MIDA,

Just make sure that the host your clients are on really know MIVA and allow and support 3rd party mods or you will have the time of your life ( ) trying to optimize a MIVA site.

Just so you know, you can have as many static pages outside of MIVA as desired. These static pages can be the one's you create and/or from the SEK or Stat Kat previously mentioned.

I need the text links on the home page to match the titles of the destination page. Example: on Home Page: <link>Gourmet Coffee Gift Baskets</link> points to the page that has "Gourmet Coffee Gift Baskets"

This is exactly how you link MIVA pages to static pages.

And there are other (inexpensive) mods that ensure all product names are enclosed in <h1> tags. Plus you can also put as many <h> tags in the html fields as desired.

There is a bit of a learning curve with MIVA, especially using OUI tokens, but once you grasp the idea, it all makes sense and becomes easier.

Lastly, the MIVA knowledgable host (dotcomdesigners.com) I use (and thankful for daily) is $79.99 for the MIVA package I chose. They know MIVA inside and out and even has offered support when it was totally outside of the terms of my hosting contract (like updating OUI for me). Plus they do not place hard limits on the server which is important, since MIVA can be resource intensive and if all of a sudden you have a lot of customers at one time, if a hard limit was placed and MIVA exceeded the limit, your store would shut down (obviously not good). But the host I use does not place these limits so you can grow without worry

Julie

[MIDA]

Thanks Julie!

So, when you market your own site - do you point all inbound links to your static home page, which points into the static version of the site?

Do you ever point inbound links to internal static pages? I'm guessing the database is only used to update pages which are in turn generated to static pages. (and of course, the actual cart process, when the user is already buying something)

Just trying wrap my head around which part of the site to use for what

[Randy]

I've either used or tested a little bit of everything Shelley. In all honesty, most of them are pretty similar no matter how much they cost.

Xcart has a bit of a unique approach by creating the static pages from the database, however the last time I looked at that one it was still in its infancy.

Last time I looked at Miva it was a bit on the pricey side, but that may have changed. Otherwise, they seem to have a pretty good handle on how to make it search engine friendly, based upon the reviews I've read. Haven't tested it myself lately.

Personally, I've never had the problem of not being able to get a shopping cart site indexed, but then again I have a few more resources at my disposal since I also run the servers. Adding a mod_rewrite if necessary is easy for me. Most people don't have that luxury. I also actually like tinkering with code, so it's no big deal when the cart needs a little tweaking. Most would rather cut off their right arm than have to dig into the guts of a shopping cart they just paid good money for.

As to which cart I would use for a new site today... Grumpus told us he developing one a couple of months ago. That's one you can be sure will be 100% SEO friendly out of the box. No idea if he's even gotten it into Alpha or Beta testing yet though. But now that I'm thinking about it I might have to take a trip over to the Cre8 forums to see if anything is posted there about it.

I actually have two new sites in the drawing board stage right now that will both be shopping carts. I'm going to use OSCommerce with both of those and apply a few mods to see how it does these days. It'll be a few months, but as soon as I have some data I'll certainly post it. If I can sort it all out I might even pre-package my tweaks for future use, who knows.

If I were building shopping cart software these days I'd probably take an Xcart type of approach. Make something that writes the actual files from a database. That's more load intensive during the creation stages of the site, but should actually work out to be an overall advantage since the database wouldn't be constantly hit every time someone visits the site.

hmmm...just what a I need. A new project to entice me!

[MIDA]

Most would rather cut off their right arm than have to dig into the guts of a shopping cart they just paid good money for.

Yep! I know just a little bit, enough to wreck everything and get tangled up so that I'd have to hire someone to dig me out!!

I've gone as far as trying to install OSCommerce but again, got so tangled up, i just walked away from it - too complicated for my level (and desire to know

If I were building shopping cart software these days I'd probably take an Xcart type of approach. Make something that writes the actual files from a database. That's more load intensive during the creation stages of the site, but should actually work out to be an overall advantage since the database wouldn't be constantly hit every time someone visits the site.

Hey, that's right, I would have never thought of that, thanks for the tip! They should use that to sell the add-on!

I've talked to Grumpus and WAITING for what will be revolutionary in my opinion! But even if it's in Beta I'd rather wait until all the kinks are out because the last thing I need, especially with SEO, is kinks But, yes, he's a smarty alright, haven't seen much of him around this forum lately, maybe that's good news??

THANKS! for all the advice!!

[MIDA]

Just wanted to add this on for anyone besides Randy and myself considering X-Cart.

I just found a company that makes add-ons for X-Cart including a Froogle feature that will automatically export a data feed based on your database. The company is called Firetank www.firetanksoftware.com (hope that doesn't link)

Thanks!

[MIDA]

Just wanted to conclude that I finished up my site using Lite Commerce which is an X-Cart product with fewer features.

The static HTML generated site is a great feature for SEO, you don't have to use mod_rewrite. Randy pointed out earlier that the static site may even employ fewer server resources, cool!

So many discussions about the best cart software regarding SEO makes me think that X-Cart maybe overlooked a bit. It's not perfect, and I'll have to pay for a few customizations but the base price is affordable so I don't mind a few extras.

If anyone has questions about carts and SEO, my knowledge has increased ten-fold after creating my latest site!! Just ask!

Whew, it was fun but glad I've launched it!

Thanks!

[MIDA]

I would suggest simply Disallowing spider access to the dynamic pages. That should be nice and clean and completely remove the duplicate content issue.

Dredging up this post again :tooth:

I'm finally at the END of this long project and need to tell the spiders to leave the dynamic content alone. I was smart (a first) and put the dynamic content in one folder with the static stuff at the root. So, I just need to learn what how to tell spiders to stay out of that one folder.

Thanks!

[Randy]

A robots.txt file will do the trick.

User-agent: *
Disallow: /directory/

Where "directory" is the folder where the dynamic content is stored.

FWIW, I'm just starting to tinker with x-Cart for a new site too. I have to admit that so far I'm pretty impressed, and that's not easy!

[MIDA]

I've got a tricky one for ya!

I have a situation where the dynamic conent is in /catalog and the static content is in /catalog/catalog

So, I can't use the folder method above (but I did use it for another X-Cart site I have that needs to prevent the robots from spidering the catalog folder) thanks

Sooooo, is there a way to say "Don't spider the page if the URL contains a certain character?"

A sample of a page URL past the /catalog directory is: cart.php?target=product&product_id=16156&category_id=249

Can I use the cart.php?target= part as some kind of disallow marker?

Thanks!
MIDA

Yes, I've only used Lite Commerce but it is a pretty impressive application. Not that I haven't felt like tearing my hair out at times! The tech support is great, delayed due to the Russian time zone, but still very responsive and helpful!

[Randy]

If I'm understanding the question correctly, you need to exclude spiders totally from the /catalog/cart.php file, no matter what follows this file name, correct? If so, the following will work.

User-agent: *
Disallow: /catalog/cart.php

You can shorten down the "cart.php" part as much as you want and it'll still get anything that matches, as long as there is no trailing slash to signify a directory.

You have to be a bit careful with it though. For instance Disallow: /catalog/ca would disallow your cart.php file, but it would also disallow your /catalog/catalog directory since it also matches.