Jump to content

  • Log in with Facebook Log in with Twitter Log In with Google      Sign In   
  • Create Account

Subscribe to HRA Now!

 



Are you a Google Analytics enthusiast?

Share and download Custom Google Analytics Reports, dashboards and advanced segments--for FREE! 

 



 

 www.CustomReportSharing.com 

From the folks who brought you High Rankings!



Photo
- - - - -

October 2010 Google Update Or Changes


  • Please log in to reply
14 replies to this topic

#1 Michael Martinez

Michael Martinez

    HR 10

  • Active Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 5,085 posts
  • Location:Georgia

Posted 04 October 2010 - 09:15 PM

I am seeing both here and in several other forums numerous complaints about lost page counts in Google's search index. Example, a site that normally shows about 2,000 pages in a site: query may now only be showing 500 pages. All the complaints are similar to this example.

I don't know what is happening but I have seen this kind of behavior before. Normally, the situation resolves itself after a few weeks.

Sometimes you can get new content indexed but Google won't recrawl old content. Yes, this happens from time to time. It may happen for different reasons each time, but eventually Google goes back to showing fresh cache dates for older content.

What should anyone do about this?

I cannot speak for Google and every SEO on the planet has their own ideas about what may be happening and what can be done. I feel it's best to take a wait-and-see approach with the older content. But there should be nothing to prevent most people from publishing new content (on new page URLs -- simply updating content on existing, previously indexed pages doesn't seem to help in most cases).

If you're blogging, keep blogging. But you might consider revisiting some older topics and linking back to your older pages in the new articles.

If you're doing ecommerce, things are a little more complicated. Maybe now is the time to roll out some new specials so that you don't do something radical to an otherwise good URL structure.

How long will this last?

I have no idea but each time I have seen Google "dump the index" it seems to settle down after 1-2 months.

Is this really a Google update?

Google says it changes its ranking algorithms several times a week, AND Google says that it is constantly crawling and indexing the Web, updating its database. So while I may be calling it an "update" Google doesn't have to call it that.

Still, calling this event an "update" at least gives us a common way of referring to some current goings on at Google.

Your mileage may vary.


#2 Jill

Jill

    Recovering SEO

  • Admin
  • 32,928 posts

Posted 05 October 2010 - 12:44 PM

But is it just a reporting issue rather than actually a real issue?

In other words, is it simply the site command that is broken (as usual).

Is anyone actually losing visitor traffic?

#3 Michael Martinez

Michael Martinez

    HR 10

  • Active Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 5,085 posts
  • Location:Georgia

Posted 05 October 2010 - 01:34 PM

QUOTE(Jill @ Oct 5 2010, 10:44 AM) View Post
But is it just a reporting issue rather than actually a real issue?

In other words, is it simply the site command that is broken (as usual).

Is anyone actually losing visitor traffic?


Good questions, Jill, and I can only say that my own search referral traffic is down but I know there are several unrelated causes. It could be I have lost search referral traffic due to this apparent de-indexing event but I have no way to determine that (without doing a very detailed log file analysis and I'm not going to do that).

A few people seem to have lost traffic as well. I know of one person who said he lost ALL his traffic (and we all agree depending on Google alone for traffic is a high risk proposition).

I'm hoping people will share more information in the coming days, in case this turns out to be something else entirely.


#4 greggb

greggb

    HR 4

  • Active Members
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 118 posts
  • Location:Oregon

Posted 07 October 2010 - 07:32 PM

QUOTE(Michael Martinez @ Oct 5 2010, 11:34 AM) View Post
Good questions, Jill, and I can only say that my own search referral traffic is down but I know there are several unrelated causes. It could be I have lost search referral traffic due to this apparent de-indexing event but I have no way to determine that (without doing a very detailed log file analysis and I'm not going to do that).

A few people seem to have lost traffic as well. I know of one person who said he lost ALL his traffic (and we all agree depending on Google alone for traffic is a high risk proposition).

I'm hoping people will share more information in the coming days, in case this turns out to be something else entirely.


I've seen the number of indexed pages at my biggest site drop considerably in the last few days. I've seen traffic referred by google slowly decrease, and today my traffic has decreased by about 50%. The cause seems to be a drop in rankings of a number of long-tail keywords. I was #1 for the majority of those and now I'm on the second page in many cases.

My website has been online since 98 and I've never done anything blackhat. I've had site-wide links for years now (to sites of my own), and I'm wondering if my drop didn't come from those?

Anyway, it's not just you.


#5 Jill

Jill

    Recovering SEO

  • Admin
  • 32,928 posts

Posted 08 October 2010 - 10:47 AM

QUOTE
The cause seems to be a drop in rankings of a number of long-tail keywords. I was #1 for the majority of those and now I'm on the second page in many cases.


Sounds a lot like what was happening in the MayDay update. Maybe they ratcheted it up.

#6 PatrickGer

PatrickGer

    HR 5

  • Active Members
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 285 posts

Posted 08 October 2010 - 07:15 PM

QUOTE
I've seen the number of indexed pages at my biggest site drop considerably in the last few days. I've seen traffic referred by google slowly decrease, and today my traffic has decreased by about 50%. The cause seems to be a drop in rankings of a number of long-tail keywords. I was #1 for the majority of those and now I'm on the second page in many cases.


@greggb:

If I may ask - Has your business actually dropped even more than the traffic? because long-tail terms are said to often convert better...?

I really hope you do get that traffic (+business) back!

@all:

This reminds me so much of the point I brought up the other day (or well the point I was wondering about) - that SEO might always be pretty much alive as long as there's just a slight margin of error in google's (or whatever other search engine's) algorithm. By margin of error I really just mean that out of 1,000s of pages that would fit the keywords only 10 can make it on the front page...and if the search engine isn't absolutely perfect at choosing the 10 "best" pages (the fact that its so difficult to agree on the criteria what may exactly be the "best" page, imho, only confirms this), only being on page 2 rather than page 1 for many keywords may mean youre missing out on 50% of the traffic (because almost nobody clicks on page 2)

if something in the algorithm changes, that affects all the pages on your website (does site age count, overall link authority,etc.) - as may be the case here(?) - and many of your pages end up being on page 2, rather than page 1 you might lose a bunch of traffic & business.

Of course this is not just negative (in this case obviously it is - sorry greggb!;( ), but if you run a site and do nothing but provide "great content", a lot of it that may deserve to rank on page 1, may only rank on page 2........and get you 50% less traffic..

I really cant see how SEO may ever completely dissappear as long as the difference between being on page 1 and being on page 2 (in a set of countless possible pages to choose from) can be the difference between getting lots of traffic, and getting virtually none.



#7 greggb

greggb

    HR 4

  • Active Members
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 118 posts
  • Location:Oregon

Posted 08 October 2010 - 09:54 PM

QUOTE(PatrickGer @ Oct 8 2010, 05:15 PM) View Post
@greggb:

If I may ask - Has your business actually dropped even more than the traffic? because long-tail terms are said to often convert better...?

I really hope you do get that traffic (+business) back!

@all:

This reminds me so much of the point I brought up the other day (or well the point I was wondering about) - that SEO might always be pretty much alive as long as there's just a slight margin of error in google's (or whatever other search engine's) algorithm. By margin of error I really just mean that out of 1,000s of pages that would fit the keywords only 10 can make it on the front page...and if the search engine isn't absolutely perfect at choosing the 10 "best" pages (the fact that its so difficult to agree on the criteria what may exactly be the "best" page, imho, only confirms this), only being on page 2 rather than page 1 for many keywords may mean youre missing out on 50% of the traffic (because almost nobody clicks on page 2)

if something in the algorithm changes, that affects all the pages on your website (does site age count, overall link authority,etc.) - as may be the case here(?) - and many of your pages end up being on page 2, rather than page 1 you might lose a bunch of traffic & business.

Of course this is not just negative (in this case obviously it is - sorry greggb!;( ), but if you run a site and do nothing but provide "great content", a lot of it that may deserve to rank on page 1, may only rank on page 2........and get you 50% less traffic..

I really cant see how SEO may ever completely dissappear as long as the difference between being on page 1 and being on page 2 (in a set of countless possible pages to choose from) can be the difference between getting lots of traffic, and getting virtually none.


Patrick, I'm glad that the stories in this post provided you with a point to segue into a conversation you were having earlier, to a topic completely unrelated to the one here.

After a 50% loss in traffic, business is down right around 50%, maybe even more. But this is an affiliate site... so my ultimate goal is to get visitors to another site with the intent of purchasing something. My bounce rate is down a bit, and I'm seeing greater views/visit and more time on the site. But the thing about these longtail keywords is that google, and every other bot and entity with the exception of the searcher doesn't know exactly what the searcher is looking for. Are they looking for information on these items? Are they looking for these items for sale? No one knows except the searcher, and they didn't say, and google didn't ask. So google somehow or another figures out exactly what the searcher is looking for with the less-than-conclusive information it has, and shows the appropriate clairvoyant results.

Maybe statistics show that people who type the names of items they're looking for are looking for information on that item 51% or more of the time? And so google gives weight to pages that have information on that particular item?

And as to the point you're trying to make, SEO will be around as long as humans are smarter than the major search engines, because as long as humans are smarter, they can play their little mind tricks on them (and they have all the motive in the world to do just that). And go ahead and tell me that that any decent SEO does something other than take advantage of their superiority to search engines, at least when it comes to intelligence.

As long as humans can game search engines they will. And as long as humans are smarter than search engines they can game them. And when the day comes that search engines are smarter than humans, I figure they'll take over the world and make us their slaves, and SEO will be a moot point.


#8 PatrickGer

PatrickGer

    HR 5

  • Active Members
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 285 posts

Posted 09 October 2010 - 08:20 AM

not exactly sure what to make of this post/reply...

QUOTE
And go ahead and tell me that that any decent SEO does something other than take advantage of their superiority to search engines, at least when it comes to intelligence.


certainly cannot agree with this statement, though...

if the SEO tries to create the best page/resource on a given topic, and then uses his knowledge of the algorithm to help the search engines find the way (e.g. build the right links to that page) in order to get the page that should rank at the top, to do just that ....I can't agree that it's as clear-cut as you amke it out to be. Reminds me of something aaron wall stated in his old seobook, that...an often overlooked "trick" was to simply to create the most useful site/page on a given topic... of course it isnt always the case, but it isn't always not the cas,e either wink1.gif

id suggest lets stick to the original covnersation


#9 greggb

greggb

    HR 4

  • Active Members
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 118 posts
  • Location:Oregon

Posted 09 October 2010 - 09:30 AM

QUOTE(PatrickGer @ Oct 9 2010, 06:20 AM) View Post
id suggest lets stick to the original covnersation


The "original covnersation" was about a loss of indexed pages and SE-referred traffic, and you changed the topic to something completely unrelated to that. In a forum where we talk about google updates and changes, I might add.

And continuing with the hijacked topic... your depiction of an SEO just going along in perfect harmony with the universe is a euphemism for someone gaming the machine.

Which page should rank at the top? Mine, of course (or my client's). That's a silly question!
So I'll just do a few things that I wouldn't do if I were only concerned about providing great content that will help google see that my page should be at the top. I'll just drop it a few hints here and there, and if that doesn't work I'll drop a few more until google finally sees the light. Then the page that should be at the top is at the top, and thanks to my effort all is in harmony once again.

SEOers game the system for their own benefit (or the benefit of their clients, which trickles down to them). And there's absolutely nothing wrong with that; I just wish they'd admit it.

And if we're going to talk anymore about this I suggest we start a topic in the appropriate place.

#10 PatrickGer

PatrickGer

    HR 5

  • Active Members
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 285 posts

Posted 09 October 2010 - 03:39 PM

this is one of the misunderstandings bound to happen on the www unless you take lots of time to review exactly what you typed...Im fully aware that I'm the one who hijacked the thread..when I said lets stick to the original topic i was fully aware that it was my "fault".

Other than that, please find someone else to take the blame, b/c your site lost traffic




#11 DaCaptain

DaCaptain

    HR 1

  • Members
  • Pip
  • 2 posts

Posted 01 November 2010 - 11:13 AM

Hi Guys, I'm new to this forum but have been doing SEO for over 14 years now.

Anyway, I saw your post and thought I'd reply.

I noticed some big changes in the algo beginning Sept 30th...it appears that google has put a lot more emphasis on the keyword phrase being in the url. I'm seeing this on sites that are not relevant at all for the keyword phrase, however their url has that phrase in it, and they are in the top 10. I know what you're thinking, why would someone have the keyword phrase in the url and not have the site's content also about that keyword phrase...but they do it sometimes.

The other thing that I'm seeing is google forcing youtube results into the serps even when they are not appropriate.

I'd really hoped that this was just the inherent problems of introducing major changes to the algo and that the serps would be better once the dust settles, however it's been over a month now and I'm still seeing a lot of bad results for some highly competitive keywords.

#12 Michael Martinez

Michael Martinez

    HR 10

  • Active Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 5,085 posts
  • Location:Georgia

Posted 01 November 2010 - 02:37 PM

Someone else brought the YouTube injection to my attention privately. Their site had embedded YouTube videos on the page that formerly ranked in the SERPs. The video injection replaced the page listing. Removing the YouTube video from their content seemed to fix that issue.

This is a very odd situation and does not appear to happen in most cases. I am guessing there is a CSS factor that is causing the transition from normal page listing to YouTube video injection. But that's only a guess.

#13 DaCaptain

DaCaptain

    HR 1

  • Members
  • Pip
  • 2 posts

Posted 01 November 2010 - 10:04 PM

I'm actually seeing a lot of youtube videos appearing in the top 10 for search terms that they should not be appearing for. It is quite obvious that google has "pushed' youtube into the serps. I'm not talking about a youtube embedded video in someone else's page, I'm talking about actual youtube videos appearing in the top 10 to top 20.

In addition, these youtube videos are by far not the most relevant for the keyword phrase searched.

#14 Jill

Jill

    Recovering SEO

  • Admin
  • 32,928 posts

Posted 02 November 2010 - 07:21 AM

Yet another way for Google to show ads. If you go to a youtube page rather than someone's page where the video is embedded, you get ads.

Brilliant.

#15 Michael Martinez

Michael Martinez

    HR 10

  • Active Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 5,085 posts
  • Location:Georgia

Posted 02 November 2010 - 11:56 AM

Well, I'm being completely speculative here, but perhaps Google tweaked the value that video citations have been given. I don't think most people need to be concerned about this, although I agree there do seem to be more videos in the search results lately.

I think the Google Place Page Update will have more of an impact across the board. Local business owners may benefit from it, but national networks and affiliates may see drops in search referrals.

Unless someone else has any information about Google's October update(s), perhaps it would be best to let this discussion end.




0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users

SPAM FREE FORUM!
 
If you are just registering to spam,
don't bother. You will be wasting your
time as your spam will never see the
light of day!