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Google Vs. Keyword Discovery


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10 replies to this topic

#1 micheley

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Posted 11 June 2009 - 01:25 PM

Hello -

I've been using Keyword Discovery for quite a while now to do my research. Recently I've also started using Google's tool since we brought our PPC campaign management in-house. I noticed yesterday that there are huge discrepancies between the two tools and the numbers they provide. I also noticed as I reviewed my PPC campaigns that for a certain phrase I got thousands of impressions on my ads in a month. Out of curiosity I put that into Keyword Discovery and there were only hundreds. How can this be?

I read through many of the other forum threads and saw a few useful thoughts on the topic but I'm still not clear. I was sure to have "exact" chosen, and not "broad". I saw a comment from Jill stating that they are completely different databases. This makes sense to me but leaves me wondering which one to trust and make my decisions by. Has anyone else run into this and how do you deal with it? Do you find one resource to be more reliable than the other?

#2 Jill

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Posted 11 June 2009 - 01:40 PM

As we've said in the other threads, you shouldn't be looking at the numbers or putting much stock in them. Look at the relative position in the list.

As far as who to trust, if you're hoping to get traffic from Google, then their info is probably going to be more accurate than the tools that get their data from who knows where.

#3 jeepster

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Posted 11 June 2009 - 04:11 PM

Having used various keyword tools and then run a Google adwords campaign, I've found Google's keyword tool the best predictor of relative Google traffic for each keyword.

#4 SteelersFan

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Posted 06 July 2009 - 05:03 PM

QUOTE(Jill @ Jun 11 2009, 01:40 PM) View Post
As we've said in the other threads, you shouldn't be looking at the numbers or putting much stock in them. Look at the relative position in the list.

As far as who to trust, if you're hoping to get traffic from Google, then their info is probably going to be more accurate than the tools that get their data from who knows where.


Jill,
Can you explain what you mean by not looking at the numbers but their relative position in the Google Adwords list?

Do you mean when I go to the Google Adwords page and enter in a keyword, you are talking about the list that is brought up after Google processes my keyword entry? The words at the top of the list are the ones we want to go after or optimize for? I'm confused? embarrassed.gif

#5 Randy

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Posted 07 July 2009 - 02:26 AM

I'm not Jill, but that's never stopped me before. giggle.gif

What she means is look at your keyword list, or if you're doing keyword research the list that gets returned by whatever keyword research tool you're using. Focus in on the number of searches shown for each phrase.

But don't give much credence to the actual number, as in just because it may say there are 4,000 searches per month for a certain phrase don't expect to get that much traffic each month on that phrase. Instead look at the relative counts. A phrase that is searched 4,000 times per month may be more valuable to you than a another relevant phrase that gets on 30 searches per month. It's also likely to be more competitive, meaning more people are trying to attract traffic via that keyword phrase.

It's not an exact science though, especially in the e-commerce world. Because you may end up finding out those "money" phrases that are quite competitive are also way too general. So general that even if you were ranked #1 and got a lot of traffic for the phrase, it's entirely possible that only a tiny fraction of one percent of that traffic would actually convert into buyers.

You need a place to start though. So when you're starting out with your keyword research and such pay attention to the number of searches as compared to other phrases in your list. Then adjust from there as necessary as you track things on the back end.

#6 SteelersFan

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Posted 07 July 2009 - 08:52 PM

Thanks for the reply Randy. :-)

When I do a keyword search and it returns say 100 search phrases, I know there are some phrases that are just off the wall with very little search activity and then there are some that incude my most popular keyword but is on a completely different subject. I know those wouldn't be the ones I'd want to pick.

Now say I was able to get 100 results for a keyword, was able to eliminate say 50. The other fifity might be on my topic but contains a mixture of both highly search keywrds and low searched keywords. Is the best tactic to try to pull the most keyword from those 50 relevant keywords and try to use them in your title tag? Or customize pages for those particular search terms?

Thanks for your replies, you've been very helpful. :-)

#7 Randy

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Posted 08 July 2009 - 03:30 AM

QUOTE
Is the best tactic to try to pull the most keyword from those 50 relevant keywords and try to use them in your title tag? Or customize pages for those particular search terms?


As a general rule, Yes that's the idea.

Those phrases are typically going to garner you the most traffic and are usually going to be more competitive in the market. Usually those 50 will have a group of 4-8 phrases that fall into this more competitive but more valuable territory, so you'll want to make sure you're optimizing for them.

This doesn't mean however that you should totally disregard all of the similar phrases that may have smaller search numbers. Most do, and it's simply a mistake to ignore them.

These lesser phrases typically require a lot less work to rank well for. Many times you can garner a top 5 ranking without even having the full phrase in your <title> tag or in link anchor text. Often a single mention or two that fits into the natural flow of your copy will cause the page to rank well for these less competitive phrases.

And as long as these less competitive phrases are still laser targeted towards your potential customers and still speak exactly to what you offer, they'll often end up being your highest converting phrases. So even though you may only get 5 hits per week on a less competitive phrase you may obtain a new customer 3 or 4 times. Whereas your more competitive, usually more general phrases might bring in 100 or 1,000 visits during the same time frame, those may only convert at a 1% or 2% rate.

And if you take your 5 hits per week phrase and multiple it by the other 40 similar phrases you suddenly have 120-160 more customers each week that everybody else is completely missing because they discount those less competitive phrases from the get go.

Long story short, yes you'll probably need to concentrate on the more competitive phrases to achieve a decent ranking for them. But don't allow yourself to become to singularly focused on these "money" phrases that you end up missing out on the real money phrases.

#8 SteelersFan

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Posted 09 July 2009 - 04:31 PM

Thank you Randy. I just updated my title page and I think I will stick with this one for a while. It has lots of good keywords in it. And now I will start focusing on some content pages using these keyword phrases.

Thanks for the help. :-)

#9 SteelersFan

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Posted 09 July 2009 - 04:35 PM

QUOTE(jeepster @ Jun 11 2009, 04:11 PM) View Post
Having used various keyword tools and then run a Google adwords campaign, I've found Google's keyword tool the best predictor of relative Google traffic for each keyword.


Those are interesting comments to me. I'm trying to figure out if a keyword subscription service might be use and if so which one. But at the same time I don't want to throw out $60 a month for pretty much the same material as I can get from the Google Adwords and Overture tools.

Is a keyword subscription to Wordtracker or Keyword or any other product a requirement for SEO?

#10 Randy

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Posted 10 July 2009 - 06:34 AM

QUOTE
Is a keyword subscription to Wordtracker or Keyword or any other product a requirement for SEO?


Keyword research is certainly a requirement. However use of any specific tool is not.

#11 mal4mac

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Posted 10 July 2009 - 07:58 AM

Try the free versions, read everything you can about them. Then you should have a good idea if they might be useful for you or not. Even the free version of Wordtracker gives you more (and less!) than the Google AdSense tool. I find they complement each other well. I think it's worth paying for Wordtracker if you want to dig deeply for long tail keywords and find out (with minimum pain) how many other web sites are using those keywords. You may go nuts if you spend all your time doing that kind of research. I can only stand it from a week to a month each year. Therefore I would only pay for a week or a month at a time. If you are organised, a week should be enough to do all the searching you could ever want to do for long-term keywords. If you pay for a week each year then you may find, like me, that Wordtracker is the best of bargains.




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