20 replies to this topic

[Frank_H]

I have a number of KW that come up in the top 3 natural search results. I am also advertising on those KW (since before we made the natural results listing).

Is there any benefit to having both? Logic would say to remove the ads and save the money, but if its not a big $$$ amount, then maybe it is worth keeping?

TIA.

Frank H.
SMC

[jtaylor123]

I probably won't keep bidding on them. Are you getting more people coming organically through that keyword rather than PPC?

[Frank_H]

I probably won't keep bidding on them. Are you getting more people coming organically through that keyword rather than PPC?

It's 65% natural and 35% sponsored. Our target market is IT professionals, so they tend to ignore most ads.


Frank H.

[torka]

There is one theory that having top results in both organic and PPC listings can help build the credibility of the site (Customer: "Hey, these guys are all over this page! They must be the industry leader" or something along those lines.). In other words, even if they don't click on the PPC ad, they may be more likely to click on the organic listing because the PPC ad is there.

I know that some people swear it works gangbusters and others say it doesn't make much difference. I think it depends on the industry, the audience and the state of your competition.

My personal thinking is that if you're getting positive ROI on the ads, then that's a net gain, so why not keep running them? But that's just my

Why not test it and see what works best for you? Cut back or temporarily drop the ads and see what effect it has on your traffic and sales. If the drop in sales is larger than the amount of money you save by not running the ads, then obviously the ads are worthwhile. So just bring 'em back and you should be fine. Otherwise, maybe you can live without them.

My YMMV

--Torka

[Jbrookins]

Torka stole my "Test it!" line.

Studies have shown that multiple exposures increases CTR. I've even seen a study that asserted that while banner ads may not provide direct benefit in many cases, customers were more likely to buy when exposed to a company's brand in multiple places.

The probable cause is sorta what Torka said, though I don't think it's a conscious thought. More like the user recognizes your brand and even though they may not know where or why, recognition is familiarity, and familiarity breeds trust. I've even caught myself making decisions based on this kind of thing before...it's rather silly, but it works.

Other things to think about are this:
--Why did they click your ad instead of your natural result? (Is your ad more clear than your natural result description or natural description not ideal?)
--Is the PPC ad at the top of the page, in line with the natural results? (test lower position if it is)
--If you pause the ad, does your overall site traffic on that keyterm decrease? (Are your visitors being lost to other PPC ads or natural results?)
--As Torka already said: Are those keywords profitable?

High rankings don't guarantee clicks. If you can appear more than once on a page, it's often a good idea to do so! (or at least test it out)

[jehochman]

If you don't take the first PPC slot, a competitor will. Testing may be problematic, to be the devil's advocate here, because the difference may be such a small percentage of your total web results that you won't be able to notice or measure the difference. Many small leaks can sink a boat. I prefer to plug them all.

[Connie]

I don't use PPC much but when I do I keep the adds running even when I # 1 in the organic results. You can't control the text displayed in the organic results, but you can control that in your adds.

For example, the other day I had an order. My site is #1 and 2 for the search term. The buyer clicked on the Add. Why? Based on what they ordered the add text was more in line with what they were looking for.

I don't think it is an either or situation.

[gaddison]

There are definite advantages to keeping your ad running- the control of the text and the double exposure among them. When I achieve good organic listings, I usually test different ad text that is something more 'promotional' in nature and is directed to complementing the organic listing.

I have had huge success running promotions in the pay per click ads that resulted in a lot more clicks on the organic listing (had way more phone inquiries about the promotion than we had clicks). Happy clients.

I also like to track "impressions" data over time so that you can have an idea if a particular term is being searched more or less.

Gord

[MaKa]

I've even seen a study that asserted that while banner ads may not provide direct benefit in many cases, customers were more likely to buy when exposed to a company's brand in multiple places.

That reminds me of the subliminal ads some companies experimented with in cinema's. In case you're not familiar with what I'm talking about. The messages where sent by putting single frames of a product -popcorn or cola and stuff- during the movie. Because it's only a single frame nobody notices it. It resulted in much more people buying popcorn and cola in the break. I think something similar could happen on the internet, where most people don't really notice banner ads anymore, but I wouldn't be surprised if they have an subliminal effect if people are reaching the buying decision.

[Aaron H]

I'd have to agree with connie, our company likes PPC because we have a bit more control over the ad text if we need to push a certain product even if it's sitting at the top of the organic rankings.

For example one of the units we sell was ideally suited to protecting poultry when the avain flu story hit the UK in 2005, we adjusted the PPC ads for this product on the morning we heard the news. If it wasn't for the quick adjustment we did on the PPC ads I'm sure our company would of probably gone under or at the very least struggled like mad.

[gaddison]

That reminds me of the subliminal ads some companies experimented with in cinema's. In case you're not familiar with what I'm talking about. The messages where sent by putting single frames of a product -popcorn or cola and stuff- during the movie. Because it's only a single frame nobody notices it. It resulted in much more people buying popcorn and cola in the break. I think something similar could happen on the internet, where most people don't really notice banner ads anymore, but I wouldn't be surprised if they have an subliminal effect if people are reaching the buying decision.

Unfortunately, an urban myth:

http://www.snopes.co...den/popcorn.asp

However I have seen other studies that confirm banner or image ads work in boosting brand awareness, and that running banner ads in conjunction with content ads will boost clicks on the text content ads, in some cases substantially.



Gord

[sassyt]

I would keep bidding on these terms anyways via PPC. It increases you chances of click-through if you're appearing twice on a page. So unless your PPC bills are way too much to handle, I'd keep in rolling.

[LazySEO]

As long as you're still getting a good conversion rate, I'd keep the PPC ads running.

As crazy as it sounds, some surfers will click the sponsored results instead of the regular search results. It implies more trust to some people, I think. That being said, there's also a group of surfers that won't click any ads on principle. I've found it's almost always best to maximize your exposure because people's online habits are so different and sometimes just plain weird.

[projectphp]

My $0.02: think of them as separate issues.

Why? Because otherwise you will go nuts. One day, in one datacenter, you are number 2. Same day, differnt DS, not there. Why give away a converting term when it may not be there for evreyone? Why spend all that time watching, checking and adjusting? The ROI of constantly checking rankings to turn CPC on and off will, IMHO, be really bad. Time is a huge expense, and simply not worth the effort for any minor advantage it generates.

So just treat PPC and Organic as totally separate issues.

[Dodgerbob]

I always view my objective as getting as many customers (as opposed to just traffic) to my site. Customers also come back again and again if I'm doing the right thing on my site. So I would never turn away 5% of my customers, let alone 35%.

I would also do some tracking on conversions between the two incoming sources, not just click through rates. Ultimately, you'll need to see if the ROI justifies the expense. But if you are bidding on the right keywords and converting clicks into customers, then it is rare that the ROI isn't justified.

One more pro for PPC is that you can actively chose to employ an extremely long tail of low cost keywords that will drive customers to you. Then you can focus on keywords where you may not be showing up in the natural rankings at all.