88 replies to this topic

[jehochman]

Personally, if you can verify your claims, I'd out the company publicly.

"Outing" a company is run-of-the-mill slander. It won't help anyone because there's another cockroach born every minute. People have to learn to identify a scam before losing their money. Lots of people make bad decisions when they catch "get rich quick" fever.

Edited by jehochman, 10 October 2006 - 10:50 PM.

[nuthin]

"Outing" a company is run of the mill slander.  It won't help anyone

I agree to disagree with that.
There's nothing wrong with telling facts.
Wouldn't help anyone?? Hard to say.
If someone finds a thread outing a company publicly that scammed a customer and that person made up there mind not to go with such a company due to facts outlined in said thread, why would that be bad???

Edited by Jill, 10 October 2006 - 10:19 PM.

[Jill]

If someone finds a thread outing a company publicly that scammed a customer and that person made up there mind not to go with such a company due to facts outlined in said thread, why would that be bad???

It's fine if that's what you like to do. But it's against our Forum Rules for many different reasons. (One being that pesky slander/libel thang.)

[nuthin]

It's fine if that's what you like to do. 

Well people like to research and know facts before choosing a company for anything they wish to purchase.

I prefer an open "SEO" industry, where people and small business can research and learn facts about a companies practices if need be, based on reviews of customers and to a certain extent even competitors.

Just seems there's not many places (authorities) willing to fight the need to be more open in this industry.

Now if someone posted about Traffic Power, and there said practices.. would that be allowed? Based on this forums policies, of course the answer would be no.

Yeah that libel/slander thing has no recourse, when it comes to facts stated. :-)

Thanks for re-instating the above posts Jill!

[jehochman]

Yeah that libel/slander thing has no recourse, when it comes to facts stated. :-)

Facts are debateable. Who's going to decide what's true and what's false? There's the problem. When people start slinging mud back and forth, everyone looks bad. As professionals, we want to avoid that.

If you have a problem with a contractor, you can sue them or file a complaint with the BBB. Your complaint becomes part of the public record. There's no such thing as slander in a court pleading.

[nuthin]

Who's going to decide what's true and what's false?

The person doing the research on a company before purchasing there services, will decide what's the truth.

Why do SEO's say, research the company before buying?

customer: Ok WHERE?

If there is no place for customers to give negative feedback about the experience that they had with an SEO firm, how is one to do a research on a said firm outside of there own current customers (if there willing to release info of course)?

Alot of people wont use the BBB (as this isn't in every country) or are not as gun happy to "sue" companies due to fees and longevity involved in this process.

Next best thing would be to post about the experience on authority industry sites, these sites will usually make the SEO'S listen if they care about there brand, or if they want to better themseleves based on customer feedback or if the customer is completely wrong they can dispute the customers experience.

The reader will decide who is the professional and who isn't.

No harm in this, clear as day the way I see it.

Edited by nuthin, 10 October 2006 - 11:42 PM.

[qwerty]

I prefer an open "SEO" industry, where people and small business can research and learn facts about a companies practices if need be, based on reviews of customers and to a certain extent even competitors.

Just seems there's not many places (authorities) willing to fight the need to be more open in this industry.

Now if someone posted about Traffic Power, and there said practices.. would that be allowed? Based on this forums policies, of course the answer would be no.

We do make exceptions to some rules. As far as calling out companies goes, we don't do it here because we don't want threads to degenerate into flamefests. We find it's better to comment on practices that people should look out for instead of naming the people who do it.

Besides, what if a site that was a client of mine years ago gets taken over by an SEO who turns it into a massive wad of spam? When you accuse me of doing that, the only favor you're doing anyone is telling me to stop claiming them as a former client.

[nuthin]

Besides, what if a site that was a client of mine years ago gets taken over by an SEO who turns it into a massive wad of spam? When you accuse me of doing that, the only favor you're doing anyone is telling me to stop claiming them as a former client.

That's where you would dispute them from being your customer.
That would be a very unique situation, hesitant to guess.

"Calling out" or "Outing" companies isn't the way would I ever put it.
I think "Providing negative feedback on companies" is the correct way of saying things. SEO people always have a nice way of putting things in there own way.

[qwerty]

That's where you would dispute them from being your customer.
That would be a very unique situation, hesitant to guess.

And if I'm not a regular reader of that forum, what if it takes a while for me to find out about it? How many thousands of dollars can I tell the court I lost because of potential customers reading your innocent mistake before I corrected you?

[nuthin]

And if I'm not a regular reader of that forum, what if it takes a while for me to find out about it? How many thousands of dollars can I tell the court I lost because of potential customers reading your innocent mistake before I corrected you?

Obviously you would tell the court such an extravagant figure so that you would be able to retire to the bahamas where you can sit on the beach and drink cocktails all day.

[jehochman]

When a notorious spammer was outed, he set up a bunch of fake web sites to slander lots of us. As soon as the outing starts, it just turns into mud wrestling.

You are of course welcome to set up your own site and say anything you like. It's a free planet.

My sincere advice to you is that living well is the best revenge. Don't obsess on the negative. Just move on to something better.

[nuthin]

When a notorious spammer was outed, he set up a bunch of fake web sites to slander lots of us.  As soon as the outing starts, it just turns into mud wrestling. 

That's where alot of people could see the maturity of professionalism that is shown from the company that received negative feedback about there service. This is a good thing for prospective customers to see, so they can avoid such firms.

If people don't want negative feedback, they shouldn't be in business that has customers nor should they offer a bad level of service, like the original poster recieved.

I can see best of both views and we would have to agree to disagree.

Edited by nuthin, 11 October 2006 - 01:10 AM.

[OldWelshGuy]

Nuthin, I hear what you are saying, but WHO should shoulder the respnsibility of possible legal action? On a forum the Forum owner is liable to a point for libelous comments. There are places like BBB etc where you can out people and complain.

That said, I am launching a website next month aimed at just this sort of thing. It is a place where people can register a busines, and say good or bad things about them. There IS a grievance procedure though that will prevent legal action against me.

Sadly it is for the UK only.

[rolf]

Nuthin, I hear what you are saying, but WHO should shoulder the respnsibility of possible legal action?

Additionally to WHO, is the question of WHY should they? how can a forum owner know who is right or wrong and why would/should they risk their time or money on it? If a forum owner gets sued for slander and wins, they've still had the cost and inconvenience of defending themselves.

Its rare for even a successful defendant to really be adequately compensated for the stress, time off work, incidental expenses and other things that make life difficult for a wrongly accused person - at least thats how it seems in the UK.

[nuthin]

That said, I am launching a website next month aimed at just this sort of thing. It is a place where people can register a busines, and say good or bad things about them. There IS a grievance procedure though that will prevent legal action against me.

Sadly it is for the UK only.

Look forward to seeing it.