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.edu And. Gov Links


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110 replies to this topic

#106 qwerty

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Posted 21 April 2006 - 06:37 PM

I'll look forward to reading the article, and hope it'll include the one citation I've been asking for. Yes, you quoted a lot of information from the patent(s) but it was all in support of points we agree on, so I'm sorry you put so much work into it, because it wasn't necessary. We're still asking for proof of that one thing we disagree on. I and others feel that you're drawing a conclusion where there isn't evidence (which is fine, and is certainly your right) and you're still saying it's there, but it's the one point at which you stop and say I need to find it myself, adult that I am.

But I really don't enjoy reading patents, in all honesty. It's not how I get my jollies, and frankly, it's not how I do my job. Besides, I love getting links from .edu sites, as I've already said. I don't need proof that they're automatically treated as more authoritative. I just look them over and see whether or not they are, without needing to know whether their TLD is a factor in that or not. Some SEOs are computer scientists, and some aren't. Guess which I am smile.gif

Somebody call Bill Slawski. I'm sure he'd be happy to go patent spelunking. Me, I've got two DVDs of German films that I've been wanting to see just waiting for my attention, as they have been for weeks, and they were just re-recommended to me this afternoon.

Oh, and have a great time in Cabo.

#107 Scottie

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Posted 21 April 2006 - 08:46 PM

<Posts unrelated to the question asked have been temporarily removed from this thread. If anyone wants to continue the off-topic discussion, please start a new thread.>

#108 Jill

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Posted 21 April 2006 - 09:37 PM

No "evidence" was removed, just flames and stuff...

#109 jehochman

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Posted 21 April 2006 - 10:14 PM

I just came back from a week in Las Vegas, and this thread is more entertaining than anything in that town. The trail ride in Red Rock Canyon was almost as good.

#110 Bill Slawski

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Posted 21 April 2006 - 10:17 PM

The section that stood out for me in the Historical Data patent application from Google was this one:

QUOTE
[0074] Links may be weighted in other ways. For example, links may be weighted based on how much the documents containing the links are trusted (e.g., government documents can be given high trust*). Links may also, or alternatively, be weighted based on how authoritative the documents containing the links are (e.g., authoritative documents may be determined in a manner similar to that described in U.S. Pat. No. 6,285,999). Links may also, or alternatively, be weighted based on the freshness of the documents containing the links using some other features to establish freshness (e.g., a document that is updated frequently (e.g., the Yahoo home page) suddenly drops a link to a document).


* My Emphasis

Of course, that's a "may" and we don't know how much of this patent application may actually be part of what Google is doing. Does Google consider all links from .gov or .mil or .edu to be worthy of high trust?


There's been a lot of talk about a paper on Trustrank across the net. Interesting document. Don't know if it has inspired any changes to the search engines. From that document:

QUOTE
The relatively small size of the good seed set S+ is due to the extremely rigorous selection criteria that we adopted: not only did we make sure that the sites were not spam, but we also applied a second filter—we only selected sites with a clearly identifiable authority (such as a governmental or educational institution or company) that controlled the contents of the site. The extra filter was added to guarantee the longevity of the good seed set, since the presence of physical authorities decreases the chance that the sites would degrade in the short run.


The authors of that paper are more closely tied to Yahoo! than Google, and it really isn't an indication that any of the search engines rely upon which tld is being used.

While we have Matt Cutts recommending to people at a Consumer Webwatch symposium on "Building Trust on the Web" that if they use site commands to limit searches to .edu and .gov sites that they would receive more trustworthy information, that still doesn't help us here:

QUOTE
MC: Definitely. The quick answer is, you can always do site.edu or site.gov in your key words and that will restrict your search only to that domain, only educational institutions or to government sites. That's a very good way to find information.


I haven't seen documents from the search engines that support an implicit trust, and accompanying higher ranking based upon links from a specific tld, with the exception of that historical data patent application. It doesn't mean that they don't skew results positively based upon a link from a page on one of those sites.

But the absence of any evidence doesn't negate the possibility either. We would be engaging in a fallacy if we made that assumption. The answer is possibly out there somewhere, maybe under the realm of being a trade secret.

#111 Jill

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Posted 21 April 2006 - 10:30 PM

And on Bill's wise words, I think it is indeed time to close the thread.

If anyone has anything additional to add that hasn't already been said, please let me know and we can open it back up.




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