21 replies to this topic

[t49]

Once I couldn't even spell web host,now I R one. ... 2 actually,but who's counting.

[torka]

I still can't spell web hsoting... err... wbe hositng... uhm, web hotsing. Never mind.

But you're on the money with your definition of "parking". If I get a great idea for a domain name and rush right out to, say, GoDaddy to register it before some other opportunist snaps it up... but I don't have any content yet, nor will I have time to create content until, oh, 2005 or so... I can still register the domain.

I don't want to point it to my hosting company's DNS yet because they're going to charge me a setup fee and I'm not 100% sure I'm actually going to use the domain. (Or maybe I'm new to the whole game and I haven't yet decided on a hosting company.)

So, instead, for the time being I take advantage of GoDaddy's free "parking" whereby the domain is pointed to their domain name servers (no hosting company set up fee!). If somebody types the URL into a browser, they'll see a default page that GoDaddy serves up for all their parked domains. If memory serves, it says something about how the site is going to be showing up Real Soon Now and in the meantime, why not check out all the great services GoDaddy has to offer...

That domain is parked. I can't specify what will show up when people type that URL. Now, GoDaddy also has a redirect of some kind ("forwarding" is the term they use, I believe, and I have no idea how exactly they accomplish the "forwarding"). But in order for that to work, I have to have some kind of content hosted somewhere for the URL to "forward" to, even if it's just a page that says "Coming Soon". When it's parked, I don't have to have squat other than the $8.95 (or less) needed to register the domain to start with. I don't even actually have to have a hosting account anywhere.

Once I change the DNS settings to point to my hosting company, the domain is no longer parked. It may be redirected or aliased or forwarded or any number of other things, but it ain't parked. As Tom says, if it's under your control what people see when they type in the URL, then the domain isn't parked.

--Torka "still wondering why we park in driveways and drive on parkways"

[BrianR]

So, I emailed my web host and carefully explained to him the difference between aliasing and a permanent redirect, including the disadvantages that aliasing has from an SEO point of view. And then I asked him if there was a problem implementing a permanent redirect for this particular client. Here's his reply:

"By the looks of what you are saying below you would need to have 2 completely separate web space allocations on different IP addresses. This can be arranged but it would mean being charged for 2 sets of web hosting charges."

So, can I ask my technical betters a question: Is this guy pulling my chain??

BrianR

[t49]

find a web host that doesn't hire idiots.
unfortunatly many web hosts are owned by non tech people,who wont admit that they know diddly squat about IT.That makes it easy for idiot techies to keep their jobs ... they just keep BSing until the 'suit' walks away in a daze.
They then hire scum sucking,sewer dwelling,lawyers to sue all of the customers that try to leave.

Been there both as a customer,and as a suit that was BSed by 5 programmers,the data supervisor,AND the office manager. Pulled the plug on the whole operation and shut the office.
It has taken over 2 years to recover. Older,a little wiser,but not wise enough not to try again.
Will open a new office in april.

Tom

[mcanerin]

For some people's systems, particularly those who are in turn resellers, this may be true, simply due the the inflexibility of the system.

You need to find someone who is in control of their servers (or has a really good reseller who is flexible). Do a IP trace on them and find out who they are reselling for , if anyone. If they ARE in control but don't know how to do this, then you need a competent host, honestly.

Yes, that answer is a pat answer that would do it, but it's not good customer service, and doesn't involve actual thinking. I'd be very concerned about their ability to deal with medium to advanced troubleshooting. Or if they are competent, then it's an opportunity to rip you off that they took.

If you have got good service in the past and they have been flexible, then it's possible someones brain wasn't working at the moment, and you could probably point out they could put your forwarded domain on ANY shared IP that they have in their system, then add one line to the htaccess with no measurable performance hit.

If they charge you a reasonable, small, token fee for the work involved, fine. But NOT a full fee for zero disk space, zero bandwidth that is not already paid for by your current account, and zero administration. Also, no backups are needed, etc. It's a no brainer.

If they have a "parking" fee, then that would probably be the reasonable rate. NOT a full account.

Ian

[Ron Carnell]

Ian said: ... they could put your forwarded domain on ANY shared IP that they have in their system, then add one line to the htaccess with no measurable performance hit.

Therein, I suspect, lies the probable confusion.

If you insist on putting your Redirect directive into an .htaccess file, then you need to have somewhere to put the .htaccess file. This is an example of what I mentioned in my first post, about where the configuration takes place (DNS, web server, or file level).

The Admin is being asked to define and create a DocumentRoot (directory) and put an .htaccess file in it. This doesn't consume a lot of resources, but it certainly consumes some. Every single access to that redirected domain will still require a read operation (disk or cache, doesn't matter), and even the tiny disk space used is much more than it appears (any file or directory requires a full disk block, even if the disk block isn't fully used). IMO, the hosting company *deserves* to be recompensed for these resources, at least to some measure.

So ... don't configure your Redirect at the file level. Move up to the web server level and put your Redirect command in Apache's httpd.conf file. This won't require a DocumentRoot for the domain, so uses no additional disk, and unlike .htaccess, this file is read only once, when Apache is first booted. The only disadvantage to this method is that it requires root access and changing the Redirect later will mean rebooting Apache. But assuming your Permanent Redirect is, indeed, permanent, that shouldn't be an issue.

[BrianR]

WOW! Thank you Tom, Ian and Ron.

I'm sure glad I asked the question! This a more complex than I'd expected (isn't it always!?), but I feel a lot more confident about discussing this with my host now, thanks to your input.

BrianR