23 replies to this topic

[onebillionviews]

Hi

My alexa rankings a month ago were somewhere in regioin of 2,600,000.

Currently they sit at 281,245

Now that's a pretty good jump. However, I am wondering whether the Alexa

rankings are related to google in anyways. On the Alexa site, it states that Alexa

is powered by google. If that's so then doesn't google consider some data from

Alexa when making it's judgement.

Also, does anyone know when the next google update is?

Thanx

[Michael Martinez]

The Alexa rankings are based on the search patterns of the 10-11 million people who use the Alexa Toolbar. The rankings are in no way connected to Google.

Some people put a great deal of emphasis on their Alexa rankings, especially if they crack the top 100,000 listings. But, to be honest, having number 1 on Alexa means squat.

There are actually professional manipulators out there who use multiple servers to spoof individual users and drive up their click-through counts for various click-counting services. Alexa's technology may or may not be vulnerable to that kind of manipulation.

There are also people who organize their user bases to load the Alexa Toolbar into their browsers and then set certain pages as their home pages.

So, you have to take the higher rankings with a grain of salt. Some of them are natural, some of them are not, and we have no way of knowing which is which (although some sites like CNN and Google and Yahoo! are clearly going to be naturally high rankers at Alexa).

No one should be worrying about Alexa rankings. You get no marketing benefit from ranking high in Alexa.

[Randy]

Where your SEO efforts are concerned:

Alexa Rankings = Nothing

[wholland]

No one should be worrying about Alexa rankings.  You get no marketing benefit from ranking high in Alexa.

Alexa results can be used for a marketing benefit. I did a succesful direct mailing campaign in which I listed my alexa rating, along with my competitors to show that my site gets more traffic. There was a definite marketing benefit.

[Jill]

What the others said about Alexa rankings.

Also, does anyone know when the next google update is?

They aren't on any particular schedule. They happen all the time. And then every now and then they do a huge major one.

[Michael Martinez]

Alexa results can be used for a marketing benefit. I did a succesful direct mailing campaign in which I listed my alexa rating, along with my competitors to show that my site gets more traffic. There was a definite marketing benefit.

You got the benefit from placing value on Alexa's rankings and sharing that placed value with potential customers. No one cruises Alexa looking for the best or most popular sites.

That was my point.

The only potential benefit to being listed in Alexa is that it may count as a good link, it may get you crawled. But you can take any company and insert some of statistic into a marketing letter and fire it off. Alexa doesn't offer you any more than any other of a multitude of ranking indicators.

It's meaningless fluff data. Many sites that don't rank well on Alexa get far more traffic than Alexa indicates, and people who read Alexa's clear and obvious warnings not to take their data seriously DON'T take it seriously.

If you can get some marketing mileage out of other people's ignorance about the uselessness of Alexa's data, more power to you.

[onebillionviews]

If you get on the movers and shakers list, that's a huge benefit from Alexa's rankings...

[Randy]

Why obv's?

What normal surfer even knows those lists exist, let alone looks at them?

Please folks, measure the right metrics! Otherwise you're going to get sidetracked and never attain a true goal.

[Michael Martinez]

If you get on the movers and shakers list, that's a huge benefit from Alexa's rankings...

http://www.alexa.com...l=www.alexa.com

One must ask why Alexa won't disclose its own traffic detail. Maybe they feel they shouldn't be pushing other sites out of their Movers and Shakers list. Maybe they cannot get on the Movers and Shakers list.

They claim that only 1% of their visitors go to other Web sites. Well, that is a very telling statistic.

It tells us that hardly anyone is using Alexa as a real resource. The movers and shakers are most likely manipulators and snake oil dispensers, or getting their legitimate traffic from other sources.

To be honest, if you want to dream big about Alexa, you're more than welcome to. I'm not going to invest any more time in discussing it. It's just not a useful service and its metrics are not relevant to anything the business community should be looking at.

It's entertainment. Nothing more.

[wholland]

Randy and Michael,
I think you are both underestimating the influence that Alexa has on the "Normal" surfer. What ever you think about their data, the fact remains that many people use them as a benchmark. I'm not arguing that their data is accurate, but that many people do look at it, and make decisions on where to spend their money based on it.

When I first started marketing on the web, I needed to place some online ads on vacation rental websites. At the time Alexa seemed like a very good way to choose which sites I should advertise on. So I placed my ads on the top 3 sites rated by Alexa. (which by the way, after learning other methods, turned out to be the best 3) Since then I have learned there are better ways to make those decsions.

My point is that to the normal surfer who is not an expert on search engines and the internet, Alexa is likely the best option they have to evaluate a websites traffic. By ignoring this you are doing a diservice to any clients (and people who read your posts) who attract business based on how much traffic they do.

Inacurate Data does not equal no marketing value. Its important to measure the right metrics, but its just as important to know what metrics other people are using to measure you. Just becuase you think it should be used only for entertainment doesn't make it so.

[Randy]

Reasonable people can disagree wholland.

Let's just say that I've had a little "How did you find us/What influenced your purchasing decision" type of control survey during the purchasing process for several of my sites for some time now. Over the years for my sites, less than 1 in 25,000 choose Alexa, even though it's a hardcoded choice.

So for my markets --which have nothing to do with web design or search marketing-- I think I'll stick with my provable stats.

[onebillionviews]

As you so eloquently say Randy "So for my markets --which have nothing to do with web design or search marketing" ...

You are trying to judge the entire issue based on "Your markets".

I agree with wholland 100%. Not everyone is an expert at SEO, and they take their advice on good investment/good websites from any source they might deem of high authority.

Alexa stats might be fake, google's PR might suck real bad... but these guys are quite powerful and they are trying their utmost to show to the regular internet user that their rankings mean something

So why can't we exploit that fact and state that by the high authority of Alexa our page ranks at a lofty so and so!

[chrishirst]

The upshot is that PR and Alexa ratings mean absolutely nothing outside of the little insulsar webmastering world, where some people think that one or the other or both are somehow important.

Go out into the world at large and be surprised at how many people out there will ask "what's google then?" or "what's a search engine?". Far too many "experts" exist only in this virtual world and rarely interact with real people, who may or may not be potential customers, many (of the experts) with their head firmly wedged in their rectal orifice thinking that the world revolves around them and we should be hanging on their every word.
The "regular" internet users out there for the most part don't give a toss what PR, Alexa or any other rating scheme anyone comes up with says, so why should anyone who is purportedly catering to JQ Public care. Apart from of course the "willy-waving" factor between their virtual "mates"

So if you don't judge things on your own market, What are you going to judge them on? Our own market is the one place that we earn a crust or two and hopefully a bit of gravy to dip them in. So judge your own market place wrong at your peril.

[Randy]

Correct-a-mundo Chris.

Usability testing will sort out a lot of issues like this. The key being to use test subjects who somewhat resemble your target market. You'll also get some major clues in how they use the Internet.

I throw my own beliefs out the window at some point before I start out in any new market. I know servers. I know code. I'm a techie.

But do I have any clue what someone buying what I have to sell might be looking for or how they will find it?

Not a chance!

That's why I test before any site goes Live these days.

[torka]

With the exception of me and at the most three other people in this building, nobody here has ever even heard of Alexa. Pretty much the same ratio would hold among my non-webmaster friends. (Yes, I do know and hang out with people who aren't webmasters! )

Should any of these friends or co-workers get a marketing piece from some company bragging on their Alexa ranking, they're most likely going to come to me to find out if this is "for real". (It's what they do for anything else they're not sure about that's related to the Web, so why not this as well?)

When/if they do, I'll quite happily tell them all about how unreliable Alexa data is to start with. How it doesn't have anything to do with real traffic a site gets. How rediculously easy it is to manipulate for your own purposes.

I'd also point out that even if the numbers were close to realistic, in most cases pure traffic/rankings are meaningless outside of context. If the marketers are trying to tell me I should do business with them because their site is so popular, frankly, they're going to have to think of a better reason than that. If a site is trying to sell me advertising with rates based on their traffic, they're going to have to come up with something more reliable than Alexa.

Bottom line, by the time I got through explaining it, these folks would probably be thinking twice about the knowledge level and/or credibility of a company that used such a biased and unreliable source as part of their marketing.

Point is, if you're banking on your audience being impressed with your Alexa rank and not knowing the limitations of Alexa's numbers, you'd better hope nobody you market to is one of my friends or co-workers...

Using statistics that you know to be unreliable in your marketing materials and hoping that none of your prospects will be savvy enough to know the difference is a risky strategy. Of course, it may work. As David Hannum said, "There's a sucker born every minute."
OFFTOPIC:

I bet a lot of you thought PT Barnum said that... nope!

On the other hand, it may backfire big time, depending on who reads your marketing collateral.

Each business needs to decide what level of risk is acceptable. For me, using something like Alexa numbers in my marketing is way too risky. YMMV.

--Torka