42 replies to this topic

[thx1138]

Umm, let me see,

20% Angle
20% Saxon
20% Celt
10% Jute
10% Norman
10% Dane
10% Roman

Probably.

Charlie

[qwerty]

Spanish, german and greek??? That sounds more like the bloodline of the royal family...not sure modern english has much german and spanish in it left overs from old germanic and latin probably.

Pretty much any English word with a gh (laughter, daughter) is from German (or at least has the same root as German), any word with a ph is from Greek, and LOTS of words are from Latin and its children, Italian, French, Portuguese and Spanish.

But yes, that is all old stuff. Now, it goes the other way, with English words sneaking into other languages, which is why the French have to come up with words to replace English ones: "fin de semaine" to replace "le weekend," or "courriel" to replace "email".

[mabont]

But yes, that is all old stuff. Now, it goes the other way, with English words sneaking into other languages, which is why the French have to come up with words to replace English ones: "fin de semaine" to replace "le weekend," or "courriel" to replace "email".

Ain't languages great

Mind the french bit reminds me something your prez said about the french not having a word for entrepreneur... he was kinda right because the meaning is slightly different but it brought a smile to face.

A living language is always hungry for new words...

[Denyse]

which is why the French have to come up with words to replace English ones: "fin de semaine" to replace "le weekend," or "courriel" to replace "email"

Sorry Mr. Q, that's only in Québec. You say courriel to a Frenchman (from France I mean) and they will giggle and think you quaint. And weekend is now the correct way, replacing a perfectly good "fin de semaine".

BTW "english" spelling is also used in Canada so that may account for a few of those links to your site Jill. Not to mention all those canucks using their funny spelling on this very forum.

[mabont]

Sorry Mr. Q, that's only in Québec.  You say courriel to a Frenchman (from France I mean) and they will giggle and think you quaint.  And weekend is now the correct way, replacing a perfectly good "fin de semaine".

Not always the civil service tries to use the term as it is the official term set out by the academy of France, but most are lazy and use the english term for it...with an accent of course

[Papadoc]

As someone who has lived in different sections of the U.S. and traveled abroad extensively, I've always felt that it was I that it was up to me to adjust to whatever cultural language differences there might be.

In that context, I would generally say that authors should generally write in their own context or perhaps to the client’s context if you are writing for an out of country client. To me, it's no different than trying to change your accent when talking to someone else. And just like an American who tries to don a British accent or an Australian who is trying to sound Texan, you can tell the difference. No matter how well you do, you will come across a word that will trip you up and it may make your audience raise an eyebrow.

Just like the accent, the spellings are often a giveaway and can give more a context to the reader of where the writer is coming from. In many instances, it is helpful to understand the perspective of the writer. If they therefore, offer a great understanding or context in which the page is to be read, a different spelling can actually add value to the page.

As for the overt gestures to other audiences, it can also come across as being too PC, patronizing, or like you think your reader is too dumb to understand that color and colour are the same thing.

From a practical standpoint, if the reader is too dumb to understand and/or appreciate that there are cultural language differences, then they probably aren’t smart enough to realize the spelling difference either. Whether it’s a Brit, an Aussie, or a Yank, if they are offended by a spelling that is different from their own, and wouldn’t do business with you for that reason, that sounds like a personal issue, and one that you simply aren’t going to overcome.

If Queen’s English speaking Brits are offended by American spellings, I cannot imagine how those would respond to a bit of London Cockney speak. I put them in the same category as a Californian who calls a customer in Atlanta GA, and is offended by the speaker’s drawl. It is only another example that ignorance can be found in every corner of the globe, and it often manifests itself as a self-congratulatory superiority complex.

Bottom line, if you try to NOT offend everyone, you are probably annoying a lot more in doing so.

[thx1138]

I'm offended by 'American English' when it's used in material specifically produced for the British market or when something is sold in Britain with a one of those multi-lingual instruction books and the only English entry is 'American English.'

I think it's rather arrogant to assume you can distort a language and then expect the original developers of the language to accept the changes.

However, when visiting an American site I would expect it to be in 'American English.'

Edited by thx1138, 18 April 2005 - 04:59 AM.

[Raphael]

Welsh, Cornish, Gaelic and Scots Gaelic...

Yes!

Cymru am byth!! y ddraig goch!!

[Hyperformance]

75% General American English
10% Upper Midwestern
5% Dixie
5% Midwestern
5% Yankee


I guess in my area, this means about 5% Slang.

My Inner European shows Russian?

Mysterious and exotic.
You've got a great balance of danger and allure. Ooooh....

[Catz]

I didn't do the actual test until now but am quite surprised with the results.

65% General American English
25% Dixie
5% Upper Midwestern
5% Yankee
0% Midwestern

Funny, you can live almost as far south as is possible in the US, but still have upper midwestern and yankee in your vocabulary. I'm shocked!

We have the southern states, and then the "deep south" which is totally different. The deep south is Alabama, Georgia, Louisiana, Mississippi, and South Carolina but the actual southern states like Texas are actually much further south in reality.

Guess Texas is so big it would be included in a few areas, we have deserts, places where it snows and beach towns as well. I'll take a place on the water any time!

[Peter Hoggan]

If you search for optimisation (s apelling) you will be prompted “did you mean optimization” this is because google uses dictionary.com to check the spelling of words used in the query, dictionary.com uses Americanized spellings. This happens whether you search from google.co.uk or .com.

Google uses answers.com for definitions which also uses Americanized spellings.

If you do a semantic search for optimization on google you get these variations; analysis, optimizing, optimization, placement, submission, statistics, optimize, job, recruitment, submit, registration, submissions and promotion.

If you do a semantic search for optimisation all you will get back is optimisation.

This is because the stem of optimization is optim which precedes the usage of the z or s.

On the other hand using colour or color will not prompt Goole to prompt you with a ‘did you mean’ option. This is because Color stems to Color and Colour stems to colour.

A semantic search for color will return coloring, color, colors, activities, paint and codes.

A semantic search for colour will return paint, color, colors, paints, paintings, draw, coloring and codes.

Some slight differences, but both words are treated more or less the same.

This adds another layer to keyword research and content writing for UK, Australian and Canadian based companies.

Obviously Google’s semantics are based on word usage throughout the documents contained their index and has no bearing on real semantics, although it is very close on many occasions.

Edited by Peter Hoggan, 22 August 2005 - 03:38 AM.

[Hillj]

Along these lines, I wonder how often to users click on the proper spelling provided by google, thus rendering the incorporation of misspellings useless. (I concur that overuse of a misspelled word is bad cause it compromises the content, but it can be used in alt text . . . )

For example, one client wants to throw in a few discreet uses of "artic" - a common misspelling of arctic - but would most people who put artic in google, click the link to did you mean arctic?

Of course, the search numbers wouldn't take this into account.

Does anyone know about this?

Thanks.

[Peter Hoggan]

Misspellings will have no reference in the dictionary nor a definition, nor any semantic meaning. So by including misspellings can only reduce the relevancy of a page for the main term by diluting on page semantics with nonsense words. Needless to say you will never see misspellings being returned for a semantic search.

Some words like centre and center, color and colour have both the UK and US English versions included in answers.com and therefore there is a definition for these words. Which may be why you wont see the did you mean option regardless which spelling of these words you chooseMy first thought was that these words returned results from a semantic search was down to stemming, I have now rethought this and I have a suspicion that this has more to do with a dictionary rather than stemming.

That has implications for UK spellings like optimisation that have no definition and return no results from a semantic search.

Edited by Peter Hoggan, 23 August 2005 - 07:05 PM.